Menopause & Nutrition: Stasi Kasianchuk Shares What Works

[0:00] Kathy: Did you carb load for this episode? Stacy: I sure did. Oatmeal, pancakes, quinoa, and a couple bagels. Jason: Okay. Well, welcome to another episode of the PTCH Podcast. I’m Jason Young, chiropractor and movement nerd. Kathy: And I’m Kathy Lynch, physical therapist, lover of all things strength training, and proud owner of way too many kettlebells. Today, we’ve got a powerhouse guest with us, the one and only Stacy Kasanchuk. Okay, so powerhouse. I’m

[0:30] gonna like just read this next part. Stacy is the senior director of lifestyle care at Janev, and she brings a seriously impressive resume to the table. Here it goes. She is an RDN, which is a registered dietitian nutritionist. A certified strength and conditioning specialist. A certified specialist in sports dietetics. And as if there needed to be more, she’s an exercise physiologist,

[1:01] and also on top of that, she used to work at the Oregon State University athletic department. Go Beavs. Stacy: Let’s go. Kathy: We’re diving into how nutrition, menopause, hormones, and lifestyle impact performance, not just for athletes, but for everyone trying to feel their best through all stages of life. This is the PTCH Podcast. What happens when a chiropractor and a physical therapist get together to make a health and wellness podcast? Jason: Chiropractors and physical therapists don’t like each other. Oh, think again. I’m Dr. Kathy Lynch, physical therapist

[1:31] who likes to help people move and get stronger. Kathy: I’m Dr. Jason Young, an evidence-based chiropractor who uses humor just as much as adjustments to help people get better. Welcome to the PTCH Podcast. Remember, there’s no I in PTCH. All right. Well, welcome back. So glad to have you here, Stacy, on the PTCH Podcast. And thank you all for tuning in again. We’re getting — this is like — we have — we are a lot of episodes in. It’s very nice. Yes. Jason: 20-ish. Kathy: This is — yeah, this is working. I feel like this is working.

[2:01] Jason: One day we’ll get it right. So, but no, we’re really honored to have you here, Stacy. It’s great to see you again. Could you start out by telling us more about Janev? Like, I don’t know anything about it. Fill me in. Stacy: All right. Well, thank you very much for having me on the PTCH Podcast. I’m very excited. Jason: You’ve probably heard of us. Stacy: A little bit. Let me — Kathy: I am one of your followers. Jason: Oh my gosh. This is her. This is the one. Stacy: I’m happy I got you that follow. Jason: Yes. Oh jeez. You got to get right home

[2:31] and listen to this. Yeah. What are you doing here? Who’s listening? Stacy: No one. Jason: Stacy. Yeah. Over and over and over again. Yeah. Kathy: Anyways, you asked about Janev, right? Jason: Yes. Janev. Yes. Tell us all about Janev. Stacy: So, Janev is a peri- and postmenopausal virtual care company. And so it is a collaboration with medical physicians, so gynecologists that focus specifically on menopause care virtually, and a team of registered dietitian nutritionists

[3:02] that I oversee, and we focus on the lifestyle side of things: nutrition, stress management, sleep, movement — all those components that we’ll get into today — and how to support women going through that hormonal transition in their life, in combination with the care they get from their physician. Jason: Oh my gosh, Kathy, this is it. This is the one. Kathy: This is the one I call — Jason: This is the one. Oh my gosh. Okay. Like non-stop. You’re not the only person that listens. I’m sorry. Stacy: Yeah. But we have a lot of people. Our

[3:32] prime demographic is like middle-aged women and they’re all like, “Please say something about menopause.” I don’t know why they’re asking me, right? Kathy: We don’t really want to hear your thoughts. Jason: And I don’t have the — you’ve heard all my thoughts on it. Kathy: But this is the one. This is going to be so great because now we’re going to be able to say we did one, and we have more, right? Because this is not going to be our only episode. Okay. Yeah. I don’t know why you say it like that. Stacy: It’s going to be fun. Get ready.

[4:02] Jason: Yeah. Shoot. Stacy: Seatbelts on. Kathy: But yes, finally the first menopause episode — Jason: be the inaugural. Kathy: Yes. And you will set the bar high. Yes. Stacy: Oh, absolutely. Jason: So, Jason read your credentials off to us. Can you just tell us more about Stacy and your journey here? Stacy: Yeah, absolutely. So, I do have all those credentials. There’s a lot of overlap, but I would say my — and this is the lens I bring to my work and kind of my path — is through an exercise

[4:32] physiology lens with the sports nutrition element there. So, I am a registered dietitian — that baseline. I did my graduate work at Oregon State University, actually in bone health and kids. So I bring that bone physiology part to it as well. Got the registered dietitian credential and then went on to do the sports nutrition specialty, which is that certified specialist in sports dietetics. Worked in athletics for a while using that. Absolutely loved it.

[5:02] I certainly attribute a lot of my foundational experiences to working in athletics, and as you know, Jason — college athletics, and Kathy too — it’s just a unique Jason: place. It’s just a unique place to be. Stacy: That’s your special way of saying those kids don’t listen. They don’t listen. Jason: They don’t then. However, the number of athletes now that I see Stacy: and they’re like, you know — Jason: I didn’t listen to you then. Yeah,

[5:32] but I’m doing it now. Stacy: I should have listened then, but I’m doing it now. And you’re kind of like, okay, so you planted the seed. And that’s some of the aspects of just normal behavior change. But it is a population that, while they don’t listen, they’re curious. They ask really great questions. Athletes want to perform. They are motivated. And being in college athletics, if you like athletics and sports, it’s just a fun, fast-paced environment. And it’s a huge deal because, well, first of all,

[6:03] everybody I talk to about this podcast thinks it’s a sports podcast. I don’t know why. Clearly — PT, physical therapy, chiropractor — I don’t see what that has to do with sports. Anyway, I think that because — I guess this is a sports podcast — we have to talk about Michael Jordan versus LeBron James, right? Stacy: Okay. Jason: Where are we going? Yeah, I can do that. No. See, the biggest difference between Michael Jordan and LeBron James is the technology. Yeah. Right. Had Michael

[6:33] Jordan had a Stacy — like the way that LeBron has a Stacy. Stacy is like a label for somebody who is super uber educated in these kinds of things. You would have had a longer career and everything. So, it really is, I mean, the kind of things that you’re doing, it’s on the forefront of like performance for everything. It’s why the super athletes are even more super today. And like today we’re going to learn how that can spill over into everyday people’s lives, too. So,

[7:03] Jason: that was just a hot take.

Kathy: We did it.

Jason: Wow.

Kathy: Yeah, we did it. And Michael Jordan is the greatest — the greatest of all time.

Jason: I think I’m still on that boat.

Kathy: Still on that train.

Jason: Can’t argue with you on that. And just to be clear, I’m not LeBron James’s dietician,

but thank you, LeBron. LeBron, call us. LeBron, if you need one. Yeah, we got it.

Kathy: We’re still looking for sponsors.

But I think that’s a great point in terms of — so, amazing experience in

[7:33] athletics. Still go back to a lot of that as the roots, and it also got me curious of how do I bring this to other populations, this level of how we all want to perform in life. And so whether you’re on a field or a court or a track, or you’re just like, “I got to get to work,” or in the case of postmenopausal patients, how do I just feel better in my day or in my new body or in my skin? And all of that has roots in physiology, which I bring to the table, so we can talk about that.

[8:06] Jason: So, Stacy and I — you guys go way back even further than I do with Stacy.

Stacy: We used to be neighbors — DBH. Yeah, we were in rival neighborhoods actually. Yeah, I was in the Morning Glory gang.

Kathy: I was Shooting Star.

Stacy: Yeah, she was over there on Shooting Star, right? Yeah, our garages like — yeah, they did. Yeah, my children used to terrorize everybody. So, yeah, that’s a long time ago.

Jason: Yeah.

Stacy: But Stacy and I first met actually at

[8:36] the gym that I now own.

Jason: What’s that gym called?

Stacy: It is called Helix Training.

Jason: Oh, is that right here in Corvallis?

Stacy: Yeah. Ninth Street, Togo’s parking lot.

Jason: I, you know, I’m always like pulling for a sponsor. Hey, you should sponsor — but that is a sponsor of the show. So,

Stacy: it is a sponsor.

Jason: Yes. Those sponsorship spots, they’re disappearing fast.

Kathy: But you met at Helix.

Stacy: We met at Helix. Actually, Hammerheart at the time, and now Helix. But since then, our relationship has grown.

Kathy: Yes.

Stacy: It evolved.

Kathy: That’s funny.

[9:06] Stacy: We just started talking about menopause one day — through menopause.

Kathy: Yeah, I talk with people about menopause all the time. Usually, like some of my homies, I’m like, “Hey, dude.”

Jason: If you don’t, you should. Manopause.

Kathy: Yeah. I’m going to be quiet now. Go ahead. So,

Stacy: we both shared this passion of like, “Why are we not talking about it? Women our age don’t know enough about it. Our moms didn’t talk about it. How do we get it out there? We’re both healthcare providers.” And then we kind of roped one of our other friends into it, Carrie Boen, who’s a pelvic floor

[9:36] physical therapist at Restore Physical Therapy, and we got together and said, “Hey, we should, you know, join a group together and we should educate people of Corvallis about menopause.” And then I think — I don’t know if it was Carrie or you — said, “Hey, what about Jessica Bell?”

Kathy: Yeah.

Stacy: She’s a PA at Samaritan and specializes in hormones. And so we all joined together and formed the Novo Collective.

Jason: Oh, I like that. It sounds like a team of like perimenopausal superheroes.

Stacy: That’s kind of what we — yeah. You should see our outfits.

[10:07] Jason: Capes and everything.

Stacy: Yeah. Yep.

Jason: Oh man, that’s awesome.

Stacy: Yeah. Yeah.

Kathy: So, we were just talking the other night — Novo Collective’s been around since 2022. Was that our — like, we’re coming up on three years here. I think it was August of 2022 that you, Carrie, and I met and we knew we had these like — okay, we got nutrition, we got strength and conditioning, physical therapy, pelvic floor PT,

Stacy: we need a hormone person, Jessica.

[10:37] Kathy: So, we came together and been together ever since.

Jason: Well, I got to say, I’ve heard great things about it. I haven’t attended myself, but I know people who have been to your seminars and done some of the material and they found it really valuable, because you’re right, people don’t talk about it.

Kathy: Right.

Jason: And there’s no reason not to, because half the people on earth are going to go through this, so

Kathy: it’s inevitable. It’s inevitable. So, that’s my segue

[11:08] into talking about menopause and nutrition around menopause. And so when women come to talk to you and say, “Okay, I have all these symptoms. What can I do, nutrition-wise, to help some of my symptoms?” And that’s a big question, I know that, but break it down for us.

Stacy: We’ll see if we can break it down a little bit, because that often is how they come in. Like, “I have all this going on. What should I do nutrition-wise? How can you help me?” And

[11:38] we have to help sort through all the information out there. So, it is interesting — I’ve been working for Janev for about five and a half years now. And at that time, 2019 into 2020, menopause was starting to get talked about, but not to the extent that it is now, which is great that we have more information easily accessible, although that can make it hard for patients — like, what do I believe? How do I know it’s true? Help me.

So with patients, I typically start with looking at what they’re currently

[12:09] eating. How do we get a baseline there? And then focusing on protein and fiber to start with. That’s just a starting point.

Jason: There it is. Protein. It keeps coming up every show. Protein.

Stacy: It’s a famous nutrient.

Jason: It is. I’ve heard of it.

Stacy: I heard it’s one of the macros actually.

Jason: It is — the macronutrients. Okay.

Stacy: And I think it’s like the longest standing. You know, they go through phases. You know, for a while carbs was pretty — you know, you entered with that, Kathy. Sorry. Carbs. Carbs are out now, though.

[12:39] Kathy: I shouldn’t say that. We’re going to talk about why they’re not completely out. So, a little bit of sarcasm there. But, you know, and then for a while fat — well, fat was out and then was back in the ’80s. Jason: Well, they were — then yeah. And then now, and then it came back in, and then like now, but protein holding strong. Kathy: It does stick. Did you get that? Jason: I got it. That’s good. Kathy: She’s good. I see why you invited her. This is good. Yeah, this is working for the show. So yes, protein — so reasons for protein.

[13:12] When I am talking to patients and kind of give them the rundown — so if you’re in perimenopause or postmenopause, you’re going through this hormone transition. And so just basics here: menopause is the one-year anniversary with no menstrual cycles. So Jason, just — Jason: Oh, thank you. It’s actually 13 months, isn’t it? Kathy: Is it 13 or is it 12? Jason: It’s 12. Kathy: I don’t know how long a year is anymore. Jason: 12 months. Kathy: Yeah, it’s the 21st century.

[13:42] Jason: Did you just try to mansplain menopause? Kathy: No, I — I was just asking. Jason: I got to go. I’m out. Kathy: So that one day, and then you’re postmenopausal. But the time leading up to that, which can be many years — for some women, five, ten, some people maybe even fifteen. It’s hard to know, because when those hormones start changing, you may not know right away. It might be like, “Oh, that symptom feels weird,” or “My body feels different,” or “More fatigued, but the next day I’m fine. Okay, so I carry on.” But during that

[14:13] phase where those hormones — progesterone and estrogen primarily — are decreasing, they’re fluctuating as they’re going down. Try not to touch this microphone. Yes. Jason: I know — you get put in prison. They like, turn off your video if you touch the microphone. Kathy: Not that I’ve ever done that. So I lay that foundation, and this is often like the education I’ll do with patients, because we want to think about what’s the purpose of the protein. And so some of the impacts of those

[14:44] decreasing hormones — estrogen especially — can impact things that protein’s important for: our muscle, our bone, and related to even blood sugar regulation. And so when you don’t have the same support of estrogen that you had premenopausally, you have to reach into the toolbox, or pull on another lever, or something else. And protein can help with that. So by focusing on protein — and for a lot of people, increasing protein where it may not have played a role previously — that

[15:16] can be helpful to help mitigate some of the symptoms that are happening with that decrease in estrogen specifically. Jason: I love it. That’s so succinct. Kathy: Right? Jason: Yeah. Are you being sarcastic? Kathy: No, I’m serious. Jason: Serious? Kathy: No, that’s it. Like, you just — you wrapped it all up. Jason: Yep. Kathy: Put a bow around it. Jason: I like it. It’s like she does that for a living. Kathy: It’s almost like she does that for a living. Jason: All right. You know, as a PT, people always ask me how much protein should I eat? And I’m like, it depends. Kathy: I know. I always have to couch it like I’m not a — a registered dietitian,

[15:47] but this is what I have heard from my friends. Kathy: Yeah. And it does depend. And I think — you know, some people — that’s what frustrates people, right? Like, we don’t always want to hear that answer, especially from a healthcare provider, like, “I’m here for you to give me answers.” When in reality, we don’t have them all — sorry. And those that tell our patients that we do shouldn’t be — Jason, do you tell your patients you have all the answers? Jason: I tell them you have all the answers — that’s why we had you on the show.

[16:18] Kathy: That’s why I asked for — anyway, so amounts. So I always start with: where are you currently? You hear recommendations out there — “Everyone should be having 100 grams of protein.” And I go back — this is where I go back to my roots in sports nutrition. And there’s all these calculations, and calculations for protein are based on body weight. And so if I think of the athletes that I worked with at Oregon State — I worked with your O-linemen, your D-linemen, and your gymnasts and your cross country runners.

[16:49] And there were swimmers back then. Jason: And there are no more swimmers. Kathy: There are no more swimmers. Yeah, they cut the swimmers. Jason: Yeah, those — they were good folks. Kathy: Yeah, they were. Jason: Yes. Kathy: And shout out — shout out went out for the swimmers. Jason: Yeah, shout out went out. So all those athletes need different amounts. And when you think about it that way, no one would say — like, I’m going to give the O-linemen and the cross country women’s team the same amount of protein. Everyone’s like, that doesn’t make sense. And so we have to think about that — that

[17:20] that doesn’t make sense even in this scenario. So there are calculations you can use based off of body weight. There is research to show, if you’re looking at protein specifically, it can be better utilized if delivered in doses throughout the day. That’s not a hard and fast rule, but some of the research — and Stu Phillips and Luke Van Loon, if you want sports nutrition references, people to look for

[17:51] from a protein standpoint — they’ve done a lot of research in that. And they have some studies that have looked at and found that approximately 0.3 grams per kilogram of body weight per meal Jason: — oh, per meal — Kathy: can be most utilized by the body. So if you want to do those calculations, typically when I do those calculations for people it usually comes out somewhere — depending on the size of the individual — between 20 and 30 grams per meal. And so you hear that often in

[18:23] recommendations. So I will often talk to patients. I’ll say, “Hey, you know, let’s start with: what does 20 to 25 grams per meal look like? How does that compare to what you’re currently doing, and let’s see how you feel with that?” And go from there. If you’re hitting it spot on, maybe we add a little boost and see if you feel better, and let’s use some other metrics like your workouts and your sleep and your energy throughout the day. And then if you’re super far off — if you’re like getting mostly 10 grams per meal — then let’s go up slowly, because if you

[18:54] increase protein too soon, too quickly, too soon, Jason: Yeah. Kathy: you have other problems. Jason: Not always fun. Kathy: Yeah. Jason: Not always fun. Kathy: So, you know, these people that are, “I went up to 100 grams and I don’t feel good and I can’t poop anymore.” Jason: Yeah. How constipated can somebody be? Right. Kathy: You’re like, well, you wanted those 100 grams, didn’t you? Jason: Yeah. Well, and the thing that’s funny is some people heard that and they’re like, “Yep, see, that’s why I don’t have protein, because it’s just going to make you constipated.” No. Protein good. Protein good. Sanity also good. Kathy: So, can I ask you a question real quick?

[19:25] Just because I think that I just want to dial back to something that you said when you were just getting rolling. I think there’s some women out there because we don’t talk about menopause much that they don’t understand what some of those symptoms are and some of those signs. Like I have patients who come in sometimes and they’re like, man, I just — I think I’ve been getting sick a lot this year, and it’s like, oh, that could be perimenopause. Or there’s — now that we have long COVID — there’s some people who mix up their perimenopause with long COVID. And so, what

[19:58] do you tell people in terms of, this is what you’re looking for that might indicate that that’s what you’re going through? Jason: Yeah, and that’s — I have had even this week with patients more that are in their late 30s. Kathy: And I think that’s such a great place, if not even sooner, to take some inventory, noticing — because it’s an opportunity to remember that we as individuals know our bodies best and we need to remember to trust that. And so when something feels off, trust that.

[20:28] There can be things that you know that could always cause that. But if you’re starting to notice these patterns and trends, so certainly some of the early signs can be changes in your menstrual cycle. So if you’re like, that’s weird, my menstrual cycle was a couple days late or a couple days early, Jason: or it was like heavier or lighter. Kathy: And it’s easy to be like, I don’t know, maybe the weather, maybe stress. Jason: Yeah, it’s that — what do they call it? — the geriatric pregnancy scare

[20:58] where it’s like Kathy: yes Jason: wait a minute, didn’t — wait, hold up. Kathy: Yes, that like hesitation, please. Jason: We hit the reset button. Kathy: Yes, absolutely. So some of those things can be signs, and I think it’s the less obvious ones — I mean, we hear about the hot flashes, and if someone has a full-on hot flash they’re probably like, oh, this might be perimenopause. But it could be even as subtle as, I just feel warmer, or I’m having trouble sleeping,

[21:29] Jason: irritability, Kathy: mood swings. And I often have the people — Jason: Maybe I’m having menopause. Kathy: This episode is actually for you. Jason: Is this an intervention? Oh gosh. Kathy: We’re all here for you today, Jason. Jason: Oh goodness, I’m having a hot flash. Kathy: Um, yeah, but so those can be symptoms. The one that I’ve been hearing about recently that’s interesting — and again I want to preface

[21:59] because there will be people out there that are like, not everything is metabolic — but itching, just this like the skin just feels itchier. And if you think of estrogen as a lubricant for a lot of different things, and changes in skin, hair, and nails, that can all play a role. Ear ringing. And I don’t want to — and some of these too, we have to — it’s hard to go through perimenopause to postmenopause without aging. Jason: Maybe impossible,

[22:29] but you know, for someone out there — Kathy: this is that 13-month thing Jason: yes, exactly, time warp. So some of these things too — sometimes it’s hard to tease out what’s aging, what’s perimenopause and postmenopause. But certainly these symptoms — it’s worth, if you’re starting to notice these, it’s always worth finding a practitioner, a healthcare practitioner, whether locally or at Janette, that can even — Jason: probably Janette. Kathy: Mm-hm.

[22:59] That you can even just find out like, what’s happening here? Because it’s better to be aware sooner and know what your options are to have symptom management if it gets to the point that you need the management. Maybe you won’t. Maybe you’re like, I can deal with this every other month or something, it’s not a big deal. But yes, those are some of the symptoms. Certainly not the only ones, but some of the ones in the beginning I tend to hear about. Jason: Thank you. Well, and I think that’s great, because I know that people — I’ve had this conversation with them — they’re really worried about it, because you get the

[23:31] whole range of like, do I have cancer, to am I sick, or am I going crazy, or is this all just in my head? So hopefully — I think that should give some people some comfort around that, you know, what you’re having, what you’re experiencing is normal. Kathy: Yeah, sometimes that makes it easier. Sometimes it just doesn’t make it easier because you still got to go through it. Jason: Yeah. Kathy: Yeah. Jason: Yeah. And different than like pregnancy, when you’re like, okay, so these symptoms are, you know, 40 weeks at max-ish. Kathy: Yeah. Jason: Yeah. You know, this is going to

[24:02] end. That unknown is uncomfortable. So yeah, that’s for sure. And then it doesn’t last forever though. Perimenopause doesn’t last forever. Eventually you switch over to something that is a little more regular for you. Kathy: And that is true that postmenopause then is when the body does start — you are at a lower hormone state, but there is more — the body’s able to adapt to that a little bit more because there’s not so much fluctuation. So most individuals, you get to that

[24:32] point, you do start to feel better — a new normal, or a new phase. But there’s less of the fluctuation. So most individuals, once they’re postmenopausal and a little bit beyond that, they do feel better. Jason: Nice. Very good. Kathy: I do want to go back to fiber. Jason: Yeah, let’s go back to fiber, because we did — we spent — we did a synopsis on protein, and I want to be clear that there’s — we can go — we could do an episode on protein. So giving a teaser there for when you’re coming back. Kathy: We’ll totally — I think we should.

[25:03] Jason: Yeah. And then we could get like different people coming to talk about protein and perspectives on protein. Kathy: Yeah, we could have protein debates. Jason: Yeah, I love it. Kathy: Fun. Jason: Favorite protein sources. Kathy: We got to find some gym bros. Jason: Oh, you must have a gym bro. Cuz I — I was wondering when you’re — I — we’re going to get to the fiber, but I was wondering when you were talking about the information thing. So, I’m guessing maybe social media is providing people some — Kathy: That social media — Jason: some real high quality information that you have to help with.

[25:33] Kathy: Yes. Jason: Yeah. And we have to sort through it. Usually there’s a little bit of truth in everything. And I always want people to come back to themselves and how we best support them. But yeah, social media — Jessica Bell, our Novo Collective friend and colleague — says it best, that social media is in the room whether it’s the patient room, the exam room, the classroom, the studio with us, whether we like it or not. And so we have to try to embrace it with some level of discernment to help our

[26:04] patients with it. Jason: So I counted — you have like 70, 72 letters after your name. So I trust you over social media. Kathy: I was like, that’s what you can do right now? Jason: Well, yeah. That’s — you keep seeing me on my iPad. I’m like, 17, 20. Yeah. I mean, you’re almost to more letters after your name than in your name. Kathy: That was my goal. Jason: Yeah. That’s great. That’s really good. You could be a physical therapist. That’s how they do it. Kathy: Pretty much, they just keep adding. Jason: Yeah. Kathy: So we have impostor syndrome. Jason: Yeah. PT, DPT, PT.

[26:34] Kathy: Yep. Jason: Yeah. Whereas people are seeing DC and they’re like, what is that? Kathy: What is that? Jason: Discontinued. This guy misspelled CD. Kathy: Wait, we’ve got to talk about fiber. Jason: Oh, fiber. Yes. Sorry, don’t let me interrupt. Kathy: So that’s the other nutrient that I focus on to start with. We usually dive deeper with patients, but that’s a good starting point to look at, that can also help with blood sugar

[27:04] regulation. So, if we — there you can see more insulin resistance. So your body’s not as responsive to insulin, and to help with decreasing blood sugar into the peri- and postmenopausal phase — again, aging, menopause, probably a little bit of both — certain factors going on there. But when we’re looking at how do we help the body better manage blood sugar, fiber can be one, and the protein — it makes it so that if you’re eating higher fiber foods,

[27:34] there’s less of an increase in blood sugar. So it stabilizes things. So for listeners, can you throw out like what are some of your favorite high-fiber foods that people should be eating? Kathy: I — so I’m a fruit and vegetable fan. Jason: Yes. Kathy: Dietitian, fruit and vegetable fan. And I know that’s so boring. But I still go back to it, and I think there’s been some episodes on doing the basics from both of your respective fields and how critical that is. And so the basics of fruits and vegetables really do wonders. Yeah.

[28:05] And so that can be a really great high-fiber source. So those plant sources of fiber, your whole grains certainly — and I know some people can’t do grains, and you’ve got to find the right grains — but those are going to be great fiber sources. And then your things like beans, lentils are also some of my favorites because they double as protein sources, too. So a variety of those different things. For those numbers people out there: 25 grams per day. You can even go upwards to 30 on the fiber.

[28:35] Again, going from zero to 100 on that is probably not in your best interest. Jason: Give it a try. Kathy: Leave a — Jason: Give it a try. Kathy: Call in or leave a comment. Yeah, leave a comment. Not a review. Jason: Call Body of Health Chiropractic. Kathy: I — we might be the first podcast ever to engagement farm using fiber. See where those downloads go.

[29:05] Jason: Yeah. But lots of benefits there. Also benefits the gut microbiome, which we could do another episode on. Kathy: Two episodes at least on the topic — plenty of episodes for you all to do. And so that — and then the other piece on the fiber that I always want to mention is that fiber helps to bind LDL, that less desirable cholesterol in the blood. Jason: Mm-hmm. Kathy: We also tend to see an increase in LDL in the perimenopause transition, and

[29:36] the vessels — we don’t get as much support, because another surprise: estrogen helps blood vessels. Jason: Oh, wow. Kathy: So we don’t have that support, and so when you have vessels that don’t have the support of estrogen and if they have greater LDL cholesterol, you’re going to have more plaque risk. So that fiber can help bind that and help with excretion. We do see increased cardiovascular disease risk in women — number one killer of women — and so that fiber can help

[30:06] with that as well. So those are the main nutrition things I focus on first. Jason: So protein, Kathy: fiber, Jason: and you want to know my trick for the amounts — Kathy: Share it, and start with — you know, use the 20 to 25 grams of protein per meal as a starting point. That may not work for everybody, but that’s your starting point. And then 25 grams per day of fiber. But don’t mix them up, because if you do 25 grams per meal of fiber,

[30:38] Jason: do a study. Kathy: You — you try the 25 grams of fiber per meal. Jason: Okay. Kathy: For 2 weeks. Jason: And you try the protein. Kathy: Yeah. Jason: Okay. Kathy: Okay. And let’s see who gets to the hospital first — Jason: if they can leave the bathroom. Kathy: Exactly. Jason: Well, okay. So all this talk of fiber makes me wonder about water and hydration. Does that play a role with menopause,

[31:08] perimenopause? Kathy: You know, I do think hydration is obviously important, and then when you’re increasing the fiber and protein it’s important. I’ve seen some information that thirst sensation can decrease in peri- and postmenopausal women. I’m going to say that the data is not robust on that. Jason: However — Kathy: or anecdotal maybe.

[31:38] Kathy: Yeah. More and — and I, well, and I — there’s research to support it. I’m not able to cite it, so I’ll put that out there.

Jason: It’s okay. We don’t do sources here. There’s one source. You know what it is? It’s Wikipedia.

Kathy: Wikipedia.

Jason: Wikipedia. And if Wikipedia doesn’t come through, it’s definitely ChatGPT.

Kathy: I was going to say, is there still a Wikipedia after ChatGPT?

Jason: I don’t know.

Kathy: Unless I looked at Wikipedia.

Jason: I don’t know. I’d have to look at Wikipedia to find out.

Kathy: Wikipedia. I hope it lives on. But

[32:08] yes, so the hydration is definitely important, and we also want to be thinking about the role that it plays in supporting movement, which we also want to talk about soon. But yes, so we want to make sure that people are getting adequate water or fluids and making sure that they’re getting enough around that. So I usually tell people — and you guys can tell me what you might tell your patients — but we want to aim for lemonade-color urine if you’re looking at that, not the school bus color, right? And then if it’s

[32:39] completely clear, you’re probably overhydrating — it’s probably not the worst thing, but sometimes I’ll start with the half-your-body-weight-in-ounces rule. But again, it depends on where someone is starting, because that could be a big jump and you want to just gradually increase them. But often I do think most of us — myself included — when you intentionally increase your fluid intake primarily from water, you feel better.

Jason: Yeah. And so the basics — it’s a weird

[33:09] thing.

Kathy: Yeah. So that, I think, can definitely — it is part of that kind of assessment of like, where are you with hydration? Could this be something that you play in? It’s also interesting if someone is having vasomotor symptoms. So those are your hot flashes, night sweats. Sometimes having cool water — like ice cold water — can help to mitigate those symptoms. It won’t get rid of them, but can help to manage them a little bit better.

Jason: See, I wonder if there’s some people who might be listening now and they’re just like surprised. They’re like, “Oh, I was expecting that she had to tell me that I

[33:39] had to get like Mongolian chicken root or something like that, which is a supplement that I just made up.” And it will be available on our website if we were putting up Mongolian chicken root, you know. And if I can’t get that, then there’s no way that I can comfortably make it through menopause. But that’s weird. It’s like it’s almost like nature’s prepared us for getting through a challenge like this with just food.

Kathy: Food. Yeah. Basics.

Jason: Yeah. But are there supplements that you

[34:09] recommend?

Kathy: Oh, that was the next one.

Jason: Yeah. Did I steal your question? No, I mean that was the — that was the number —

Kathy: I mean, besides obviously the Mongolian chicken ring.

Jason: Yes, that one’s number one.

Kathy: Yeah, I know. You just invented it.

Jason: Yeah. Uh-huh. We are the number one search result for Mongolian chicken root at this point.

Kathy: Someone’s googling that right now.

Jason: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And they’re just coming up with this video.

Kathy: Sorry. Sorry. So, probably not surprising, and

[34:39] certainly a food-first approach, and then we supplement where we need to. Some that I do think can be helpful as kind of baseline are your fish oil omega-3s. And that is one where, when we’re thinking about supplement options, looking for a high-quality brand — I tend to lean towards third-party verified supplements. Doesn’t guarantee that they’re — like, because supplements are not regulated — because we could right now just

[35:10] make that Mongolian chicken root. Is that what you call it? That’s it. Yeah. You’re familiar with it.

Jason: We make it and we could sell it.

Kathy: We could.

Jason: And we could just see how long we can get away with it, because that’s really what any supplement brand can do.

Kathy: Absolutely.

Jason: The only thing to regulate it is the label and claims.

Kathy: Yeah. Yeah.

Jason: Yeah. And even that doesn’t have to match what’s in the —

Kathy: All we have to do is not say that it cures menopause.

Jason: Yeah.

Kathy: Maybe we can say it helps.

Jason: Yeah, kind of.

Kathy: Sort of.

Jason: If you know someone with this —

Kathy: Yeah,

[35:40] you could take this chicken root.

Jason: Three out of 10 helped, right?

Kathy: So, however, the fish oil is one that you want to have a high-quality one, because there can be some —

Jason: Yeah, sketchy brands out there, or less quality.

Kathy: Yes.

Jason: Well, and less ethical. Yeah. There’s some people out there that are doing shady stuff to —

Kathy: Yeah.

Jason: — make a —

Kathy: You get you some fish grease.

Jason: Yeah. Yes. And that’s what it ends up being. Yeah.

Kathy: Yeah. So,

[36:12] a high-quality one. I typically recommend that you’re looking for EPA and DHA on the label to add up to about 1,000 to 1,200 mg.

Jason: Okay. From your — do you have any thoughts on —

I think that’s a good starting point. Usually when I’m talking with people about fish oil, it’s because of the anti-inflammatory properties. So I tend to swing a little higher, which is like 3,000 to 6,000 milligrams of EPA and DHA combined

[36:45] when you start getting those anti-inflammatory effects. You don’t really have trouble with fish oil until you get up to like 10,000 milligrams. And so it’s nice because there’s a big safety threshold with it.

Kathy: There’s just not always a big tolerance threshold.

Jason: Yeah.

Kathy: Who wants to try the 10,000?

Jason: Yeah, reference the fiber and protein.

Kathy: Another study. Should we begin?

Jason: Okay, you’re doing protein. I’m doing — you have to do the fish oil.

[37:16] 10,000 milligrams. And you’re all going to be in the room with me as I brief.

Kathy: Absolutely. And Scott, be careful. We’re coming for you next. So, yeah,

Jason: you’re next.

Kathy: Whatever gets mentioned next. So, that is one. And then yes, anti-inflammatory — as well as along the lines of anti-inflammatory, but those cardiovascular — like the vessel benefits — it’s mixed on whether it’s going to actually decrease cholesterol; that’s not as strong of support there. However, the integrity

[37:47] of the vessels where we need the blood to flow through. The omega-3s can help with that, right? And cholesterol issues are worse when you have inflammation and oxidation and things like that, which — if you have a bad fish oil, the problem is that it’s pro-oxidant and so it’s like you could be doing more harm than good. So yeah, can’t say enough about a good quality fish oil. Yeah. What about B vitamins like B6,

[38:19] B12 in particular? I know that you said that you tend to do food first, but is that one that you recommend for supplementation? I know that those two pop up a lot in some of these like women’s multivitamins, which should not be taken by men, no matter what. What happened when you — you know — speaking from experience. No, it’s just it’s another labeling thing, right? It’s like this is a multivitamin for women, only for women. Don’t you touch that, man. Yeah. And ladies, don’t you definitely

[38:50] don’t touch that man’s multivitamin. Definitely not. Yeah, because we didn’t put that on there for marketing. Not at all. I do not typically recommend B vitamins individually. However, I will recommend B12 testing, and if I — and I can also, if a patient’s able — not all practitioners will order an MMA, a methylmalonic acid, but then we can actually look both at the B12 and the methylmalonic acid to look at the utilization in the body to get a better

[39:20] idea if someone needs B vitamin supplementation, and then I’m looking for methylated forms of those. But that’s usually a little bit more specific, and if there’s energy concerns it’s kind of not like a blanket recommendation. Right. Yeah. With that there’s less risk with B vitamins because they are water-soluble, but I typically don’t recommend them by themselves unless we know what we’re measuring, because you can retest and see if this is working. Well, and it’s kind of — I mean, and I get

[39:52] that too — because it’s kind of stupid to like do the mono-supplementation, because this is not even what you see in nature, right? Right. Like, eat these grapes because they have this vitamin, but they don’t have that vitamin. Yeah. Yeah. The body utilizes food differently and there is room for supplements. Certainly I would say vitamin D, especially in the Pacific Northwest,

[40:22] is one that I typically recommend. Another one that I still want people to test for though, if we can, because then you kind of know — like, what am I talking about with dosing? I mean, if you’re super low, you don’t want to just hang out with 2,000 IUs and wait for them to get up into a normal range. But if they’re low-normal, or if they’re in a normal range, then we can talk about okay, what’s a good maintenance dose around that vitamin D. I tend to think — my experience has been — you can do the store brand. We don’t have to go super fancy with the vitamin D. It seems pretty simple, and if we’re looking for cost effectiveness, that’s typically what I want. But if other people are

[40:53] like, “Give me the high quality one,” okay, you can spend more. And yeah, that’s one that gets kind of scammy, where it’s like, “Oh, we’ve got hydronic chloric vitamin D.” And it’s like, “What is that?” Well, we made it up so we could sell more. But yeah, vitamin D is another one with a really wide safety threshold too. And so, but yeah, it’s just — I think in general getting supplements from a third-party-tested

[41:24] company is good. We’re actually going to do a supplements episode, right? Yeah. Oh, yeah. One of these days, maybe we’ll have you on to bash that guy. The supplement guy, and then we’ll talk about protein. Yeah. We’ll be like — we got Stacy — and I don’t want to drop his name. We got Stacy here, and we’re going to lock the door. Good luck. Let’s see where it goes. You guys are just going to end up agreeing on everything. It would be the most boring episode ever. So,

[41:54] and I’m sure we’re going to get this question if we haven’t gotten it already. Creatine. Oh, creatine. Oh, yes. Yes. On creatine. So creatine is fascinating. I do have a little — can I tell a story? Absolutely. Story time. We’re here for the stories. I will share this anecdotally again, and we’ll back up. I haven’t taken creatine for years. So I started —

Kathy: was like, “Let’s get Stacy on.” I’m like, “Stacy?” She’s like, muscles.

[42:24] Oh, right. She must know her stuff. So I was working in athletics, and part of my job was to help educate athletes on supplements and, as you know, like crazy supplements all around the board, and those athletes are drug tested. So you are like, we have got to educate you. Your scholarship could be on the line. Like, let us not make some poor decisions here. So have you seen that before? Like, people who have been disqualified over supplements? Yeah, I can think of at least one,

[42:54] at least one. Yeah. And it’s like, hold — the worst, anyway. Yeah, exactly. And never mind that sometimes those supplements actually could harm you. What? Yeah, there’s danger, danger. So I didn’t want to try any of those supplements. However, there was a little bit of me that’s like, okay, these athletes are taking these supplements. Like, I’m an active individual. Creatine is one that has so much research out there on it. I mean, there are researchers that have dedicated

[43:25] their lives to just creatine. Like, that’s what they do. They just study creatine for years and years and years. And so I was like, “Okay, pretty safe. I’m going to get myself a third-party-tested supplement. I’m going to start taking this for my workout.” So I’ve been taking that for a while and kind of paying attention to the research around it. And then it was interesting to start seeing more information coming out on bone, and I will be completely — I felt like I had a little bit more like oomph in my workouts, but I wasn’t like

[43:56] Jason: knocking down doors and it wasn’t like I was even really like just like PRs everywhere, you know? Kathy: You were just swinging one of Kathy’s many. Jason: I was probably able to increase my kettlebell. But it also was because I was doing the exercise, cuz I didn’t just take the creatine and then Kathy: right Jason: sit around and hope that works. Kathy: Yes. Jason: If you exercise — yeah, if you’re not exercising, start there first. It’s like the fruits and veggies.

[44:27] Kathy: Well, and do a little science, right? Jason: Start working out. See how much that sucks. Kathy: Then get yourself a little creatine and like, oh my gosh. It’s like I got an ebike. And like that’s how it was. I spent my whole life riding those crappy bikes and then I got the ebike and I was like, “Oh my gosh, this is like creatine.” Jason: I’m on creatine now, y’all. Kathy: Yeah, I’m riding down. I’m on creatine. Like, it’s an ebike. No, it’s creatine. Jason: Look at me. Kathy: Trust me. Ding, ding, ding.

[44:59] Jason: You all don’t know what you’re talking about. Kathy: Creatine is cheaper than any ebike. Do the creatine. Yeah, Jason: definitely. Kathy: We should do an episode on ebikes. Sam and I were just talking about ebikes and ebike culture in Corvallis. It’s hilarious. So, that could be — Jason: there’s something deep in it now. I have my own ebiker gang. Kathy: Yeah, I was going to say, do you guys have a secret club? Jason: Actually, it’s more like this.

[45:29] Kathy: Echo. Jason: It’s fun. I will say this about ebikes though, which is totally unrelated to the subject at hand, but the way that I ride is like I’ll just cruise around like riding the throttle and then if I see people, it’s like, oh, Kathy: I’m pedaling. Jason: I just have this for the — Kathy: yeah. I get the water bottle, man. It’s hot out here, huh? Jason: I am pedaling hard here. Kathy: Really getting the workout in. Coach Podcast, we work hard. Jason: Keep these — got to keep these legs moving. Yeah.

[46:02] Oh my goodness. Okay. Kathy: So, creatine. So, it’s been interesting to see this evolve in the perimenopause space. I will also, if you’re interested in a lot of the research that’s being done in this — in women specifically — Abby Smith Ryan out of University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill is really doing high-quality dedicated research to this. Not surprised. They’re smaller studies because it’s a smaller population to look at. So there may be

[46:32] some individuals that say, “Well, that study is so small. What can you tell from that?” But she’s doing a really good job of designing them well and getting some information from that. Jason: I bet it’s going to get bigger though, because the money is showing up in creatine. Kathy: Yes. Which would be helpful to provide more information. Jason: Absolutely. Kathy: And there are brain benefits too. Jason: Yes. And some of that has come out of the TBI research — in military — Department of Defense. Kathy: Same thing. Jason: Yeah. Has done —

[47:03] Kathy: go see Superman. Jason: The Justice League was doing some research. Kathy: Yes. A little crossover there. Whoopsies. But looking at — and then interesting case studies too — we don’t want to have hundreds of thousands of people with TBI; that would be awful. So we can’t really do that randomized control trial either, because that also is not ethical. Jason: However, we can learn from case studies. Kathy: And coming back to what creatine is, it is a part of metabolism, part of that

[47:34] ATP energy generation at the mitochondrial level, Jason: and we have that in the brain. Kathy: And so there has been research looking at that. I think it’s still in its infancy to say — what we see some claims out there is — oh, perimenopausal women take creatine and prevent Alzheimer’s. Jason: Mhm. Kathy: We’re not there yet. Jason: That’s where we’re hoping we’ll get there. Kathy: Well, there’s such a nexus of things though, because when you think about things like — one of the symptoms of perimenopause is you

[48:06] get some brain fog, right? Jason: Mhm. Kathy: But then also when you start having dysregulation of blood sugar — Jason: yeah. Kathy: — when you can’t regulate blood sugar, that has a pretty high connection to dementia and Alzheimer’s, Jason: to the point where they are starting to call Alzheimer’s type 3 diabetes. Kathy: Right. And so it’s just — it’s all of these things, right? And so it’s like Jason: you can’t look for one miracle nutrient, one miracle supplement. It is just — you’ve got to take care of the whole machine.

[48:36] Unfortunately, this comes at a point when we should be old enough and experienced enough to just know better and take care of ourselves. But no, we’ve had like children and careers and stuff that have beaten the crap out of us. Kathy: Well, yeah. And it is that type of life too where you may have children that are — maybe they’re going off to college, or they’re also going through their own hormonal shifts. Or you have older adult parents that you’re also caring for, or you’re at different points in your career where you may have more responsibility. And so timing is really not greatly planned.

[49:07] Jason: No, no. Kathy: That design is not well thought out. Jason: Um, so I would say on the creatine — it is not like there are so many other things to do before creatine. If you’re an active individual, if you have bone health concerns with resistance training, there could be some benefits specifically to bone strength, not necessarily to bone density yet — we haven’t seen that consistently — but looking at strength and geometry metrics to bone. So there could be some benefit with that, and then certainly benefits to building a little bit of extra

[49:38] muscle. So there are opportunities to try it. I would say if someone wants to give that a try, just not to make it your like, “I’m going to do creatine and that’s going to be my answer.” Jason: Yeah. Push this button, fix the problem. Kathy: Exactly. The last supplement I will add is magnesium glycinate. I do find a lot of patients find benefit to their sleep. It’s not a sedative, but it just provides a little bit of a calming, turns off some of the racing thoughts. Another one that I think — third-party verified supplement — it could be worth

[50:09] the investment.

Jason: Excellent.

Kathy: I think those are the main ones that I kind of — then, you know, different patients have different questions and certain situations might bring up some other stuff.

Jason: Sure. Those are the basics.

Kathy: But we’re not providing medical advice here.

Jason: No, we are not.

Kathy: I am not.

Jason: I am. Do what I say. You’re going to live forever. Money back guarantee.

Kathy: No.

Jason: You must collect in person.

Kathy: No. Please seek counsel of your own healthcare provider.

Jason: Okay. It’s not healthcare advice. Fine. This is entertainment only.

[50:40] Entertainment only for —

Jason: Should we turn to a couple myths we want her to bust?

Kathy: Yes, please.

Jason: Yeah.

Kathy: We haven’t talked about my favorite — carbs.

Jason: Oh, thank you. List of them. Are you still — how are you feeling after all those carbs?

Kathy: Yeah.

Jason: I’m feeling a little crashy.

Kathy: Yeah, they’re the main cause of menopause right here. Yeah.

Jason: So, carbs — are they still the enemy? And fat — does it make you fat?

Kathy: So, I try — you know, I always think like these macronutrients that we talked about are already like fighting for

[51:10] the spotlight. But they really can’t like defend themselves. So I try not to make one like good or bad. Like, they can’t — that’s not fair. So let’s just give them their time to shine.

Jason: Carbohydrates — they never saw it coming.

Kathy: I know, they’re just like, beat down. I’m totally name-dropping but I’m just going to keep doing that. But one of my favorite quotes — Luis Burke, who was the former director of the Australian Institute of Sport and has done a ton of research in carbohydrates

[51:40] in athletes. She presented at the American College of Sports Medicine at a conference that I went to several years ago, and she was talking about the effects of carbohydrate and this idea — now we hear like no carb, low carb, high carb, carb bloating — and she said it’s not any one of those. It’s not low carb, it’s not high carb, it’s not no carb, it’s smart carb.

Jason: And so how are you smart and strategic with your carbohydrates? And what I think we run into again is these all-or-nothing extremes, and individuals

[52:10] will say, “Oh, well, I want to lose weight, so I want to do low or no carbohydrates.” So then they cut it all out and they do lose weight, because carbs hold water. They’re probably also eating less, and then it’s like, “Cool, look at — I just lost all this weight.” Then they add in a little bit of carbohydrate, they gain the weight back, and immediately they’re like, “Oh, it’s the carbs that make you gain weight.

Kathy: This did it.”

Jason: And so then we have these

Kathy: thoughts that just aren’t helpful either. But if we want individuals to be active, then you need some level of carbohydrate. And we’ve got to think about

[52:41] the amount and be strategic on that. If you’re going for a 30-minute walk at a leisurely pace, you probably don’t need to carbo-load like Kathy did before the show.

Jason: How’s that working out? Are you doing all right?

Kathy: Oh —

Jason: I think it’s improving your performance in a lot of ways.

Kathy: Today’s my best show.

Jason: Yeah.

Kathy: Yeah, it is. I haven’t added creatine yet. So yeah, that’ll be one of my next performance —

Jason: Well, and I think also when you think about carbohydrates,

[53:11] you know, it’s the name of a molecule, right?

Kathy: Right.

Jason: And it’s like if I put four molecules in front of you, the average person couldn’t tell what’s a carbohydrate, right? So it’s like rather than focusing on that molecule, you should focus on the forms that they come in. So carbs bad? Well, yeah, if that carbohydrate is just like a pile of sugar.

Kathy: Mm-hmm.

Jason: Right. But carbohydrates are also lettuce,

Kathy: right?

Jason: Right. And it’s also rice.

[53:41] And so it’s like — intuitively we know — you just know you’re getting a bunch of like sugar and highly processed carbohydrates.

Kathy: It’s going to taste amazing.

Jason: Yes. But it’s probably not going to get the ball across the goal line if you’re looking for —

Kathy: or support the goals. Yeah.

Jason: Eat healthy carbohydrates. What’s a healthy carbohydrate? Well, duh. I think people know what healthy carbohydrates are. Like fruits and vegetables,

Kathy: right?

[54:12] Jason: I mean, is it that hard? It’s like think of the healthiest carbohydrate you can. It’s like — it fell off a tree or I pulled it out of the ground, you know,

Kathy: that’s probably good for you.

Jason: Yeah, it’s a pretty good carbohydrate. And it’s not the only kind. You can have some sugar, but it’s like —

Kathy: Yeah, eat healthy carbohydrates.

Jason: Yeah,

Kathy: it’s just that easy.

Jason: Kind of easy.

Kathy: How about this? Eating late at night causes weight gain.

[54:42] Jason: You know, I saw you that question. So, no — not blanket statements. I think we again need to think about our days and we need to think about where we need our energy and using that strategically. What I do sometimes see, however, is that individuals will — if they want to experiment with intermittent fasting, or there’s a whole club, an echelon of people that

[55:12] for some reason don’t like breakfast, or they have stomach problems, and there’s history to that. There could be so many things involved with that, and some people are never going to eat first thing when they wake up, and that’s just their gut and the way they are. And that can be fine. There can also be ways to start to train the gut to be able to have something in the morning, or that first meal of the day. But sometimes people lean into that and not eat, and then they’re like, “Oh, I’m good, I didn’t eat.” And then they get to lunch and they’re busy so they skip that — “I was good,

[55:42] I didn’t eat.” They get to dinner and don’t know why they’re starving.

Jason: Yeah.

Kathy: What’s wrong with everybody?

Jason: I can’t — at dinner I’m good all day long and then at dinner I just eat so much.

Kathy: And so when you start — I’m like, let’s just try something in the morning, and then we can start to decrease some of the cravings or have more portion control at night.

And then that can be helpful. So if you’re only eating all of your

[56:12] calories right before bed, that may have some detrimental effects to several things.

Kathy: Yeah.

Jason: I think the problem comes when people try every method at once.

Kathy: Oh my gosh.

Jason: I’m going to eat all my calories in the morning

Kathy: and at lunch.

Jason: Yes.

Kathy: And then I’m going to try doing a dinner. I’m just going to try that experiment every day.

Jason: Intermittent fasting. I’m going to fast for 15 minutes.

Kathy: Yeah. I’m intermittent slowing. Yeah.

Jason: Well, there’s so much more I feel like we could talk about with Stacy. We might

[56:44] have to have her back again.

Kathy: I think. Absolutely. She’s —

Jason: I got another “Absolutely.”

Kathy: Oh gosh. Yeah. We’re not done with you. Not done with you. I do think that we should probably play a game though.

Jason: We do. I love your game though.

Kathy: Requirement. Yeah. Well, I think that you’re going to like this because this is a game that we’ve done before. We reserve this for special experts. I think it’s time to do a Mad Lib.

Kathy: Brings me back to my childhood and —

Jason: Yes. Okay.

Kathy: Car game, like long car trips.

Jason: Yes, totally. Well, and you know,

[57:16] they’re just so fun and educational, right?

Kathy: Yeah.

Jason: What’s an adverb?

Kathy: I was just going to say I hope it’s an L-Y.

Jason: Yes. Very good. See,

Kathy: I can remember my language arts skills.

Jason: When I was in school, I had no reason to know that that was an adverb. When I did Mad Libs, though, it’s like yes.

Kathy: Yes. And they also told you it was

Jason: a verb ending in -ly. All right. Okay. Are you ready?

Kathy: Okay.

Jason: Okay. We’re gonna slide through this pretty quickly. Kathy’s going to put the words in and

[57:46] then I’m going to read you this very serious document. Okay. Give me a verb ending in -ing — for the people at home, a verb is a doing word.

Kathy: I’m going to go running.

Jason: Running. Okay. Let’s have an adjective.

Kathy: Green.

Jason: Green. Okay. And a number.

Kathy: 23.

Jason: 23. That’s what I thought she was going to say. LeBron James and Michael Jordan.

Kathy: Michael Jordan. Okay. Plural noun — it’s more than one person, place, or thing.

Kathy: Let’s go with dogs.

Jason: Dogs. Good. I was hoping you’d say that.

[58:16] Liquid.

Kathy: Water.

Jason: Water. Yes. Okay. A food ingredient.

Kathy: Oh, that’s a lot of pressure. A food ingredient — I guess flour.

Jason: Flour. Yes. A country.

Kathy: Australia.

Jason: Australia. A number

Kathy: again?

Jason: Yeah.

Kathy: Let’s go 20 this time.

Jason: 20. Good. And a food.

Kathy: Any food?

Jason: Ice cream.

Kathy: Okay. And a number.

[58:46] 15.

Jason: An emotion.

Kathy: Happy.

Jason: A body part.

Kathy: I’m going to go uterus — we’re talking.

Jason: Awesome. This is the best ever. Give me a verb ending in -ing.

Kathy: Sitting.

Jason: An animal noise.

[59:17] Kathy: Oink.

Jason: Oink. A food.

Kathy: Another food — we’ll go lettuce.

Jason: Okay. A health professional.

Kathy: Registered dietitian.

Jason: Okay. And we got two more. A kitchen appliance.

Kathy: A mixer.

Jason: Mixer. And a product name — any product name.

Kathy: Like a brand name, or just a — oh,

Jason: yeah.

Kathy: Oh, a brand name. You stumped me on this one. Let’s just go —

[59:50] Nordic Naturals comes to mind. I don’t know.

Jason: Nordic Naturals. That is the fish oil. I knew when you were talking about fish oil, you wanted to say Nordic Naturals — but yeah, that’s a brand that I recommend to people. Pretty dope. Nordic Naturals. All right, here we go. You ready?

Kathy: Mhm.

Jason: Okay. A totally not-at-all suspicious miracle diet, presented by Stacy, the dietitian who’s seen it all. Are you tired of running your way to better health with boring things like exercise and balanced

[60:21] meals? Introducing the brand new green miracle diet that guarantees results in just 23 days. All you have to do is eat dogs, drink water, and avoid anything that contains flour. This sounds real. This revolutionary method was discovered by a monk in Australia who lived to be 20 years old and survived solely on ice cream and resentment. With this plan, you’ll lose 15 lbs, gain

[60:51] happiness, and finally get rid of that pesky uterus fat. Side effects include excessive sitting, spontaneous oinking, and craving lettuce at midnight. So stop listening to RDNs, and start trusting your gut. Literally. Just call now — we’ll throw in a free mixer and a month’s supply of Nordic Naturals. Because when it comes to health, who needs science when you’ve got hype?

[61:21] Kathy: You know what? We’ll send you this and you can use it

Jason: for your next Ozempic ad.

Kathy: Yes. Yes. Absolutely.

Jason: Oh my gosh, that was really good.

Kathy: Okay, well for the last —

Jason: I think that pretty much wraps us up, right? So, we got to say the end-of-show stuff, which is — definitely, thank you so much.

Kathy: This was fun. You already got your invite to come back.

Jason: Get to GLP-1.

Kathy: Okay. We love it when we have people who are really experts in what they

[61:53] do. And so we put you in that gold star expert category. And I’m so happy that we got to start having these conversations because everybody’s been asking about them. So that’s great.

Jason: Yeah. And that’s the teaser — so next time Stacy’s on, we’re going to talk about GLP-1s.

Kathy: Ooh. Yes. So you better figure out what those are. Let me see if I can find, you know, like a social media post or two.

Jason: Yeah, that’s good. Yeah, you should download Instagram — you’re going to learn a lot.

[62:23] Kathy: You’re going to learn so much.

Jason: Or TikTok.

Kathy: I recommend TikTok.

Jason: Yeah. So, everybody should do what Stacy does and subscribe to the PTCH Podcast. Listen, memorize the episodes, share. And definitely share with your friends — we love reviews. Spotify, YouTube, Apple Podcasts.

Kathy: Send your questions in.

Jason: Yes, absolutely. You can comment questions. You can question people’s comments.

Kathy: Call Body of Health if you have questions for the PTCH.

Jason: Yes. And I’ll refer you over to Encore.

[62:55] Jason: Have like an automatic form.

Kathy: All right. I think that’s good except there’s one important thing that we forgot. You know what that is?

There’s no “I” in PTCH.